Curse

Chief · May 31, 2005, 06:01 PM // 18:01

1. I have been in too many missions lately that we have XP lechers or they have their own agenda altogether (basically they stay in mission and hunt for objects and will stay there until the team all quits).

2. Another is where you have people that are only after an ELITE skill and then quit team once captured.

Both of these are happening way too much and are getting out of control. I finished the game with my first character with very little difficulty and great teams. The second character I started seeing hints of #1 and #2. Now I’m on my 3rd character and it’s almost difficult to even play without things like the above happening.

RECOMMENDED FIX: Implement a vote-kick option in the game for #1.
For #2, for missions, your ELITE skill is not awarded until completion of the mission.

Sting · May 31, 2005, 06:09 PM // 18:09

Pretty good ideas but most will not like it, because most people on here beleive the greivers rights outweigh those of the rest of the group. I came up with an idea for PvP where quiters there get ranked it would give 2 freebies and a reduction by one every 5 missions completed, also wouldnt count against those that lost connections but it got ran into the ground also.

RepinsMirg · May 31, 2005, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Kick option is to open to abuse. A guild just needs one more person to finish a mission and just because the feel like it right before they complete they kick him from the group.

EcPercy · May 31, 2005, 07:43 PM // 19:43

I think that the kick option is a good thing. Here is my example for a need in it:

A PUG and I was working on Elona Reach. At first things were going well and we proceeded to give the first crystal with little effort. We had a W/Mo in the group that took off when we were near the second crystal and ran in to get it. Of course there were a few mobs in between him and the crystal and he was easily killed. The guy started spamming the team chat window with "I HAVE THE CRYSTAL" and "COME REZ ME NOOB PEN** LICKERS" and circling the map and ringing the map like we didn't know where he was. (we had to kill the mobs he ran at us)

Once we killed everything and brought the person back he continued to call us NOOBS and other names for not rezzing him sooner so he could help. We get over by the last crystal and the guy repeated the same action by running in and getting the crystal without bothering to fight anything. Most of us died.

The guy makes it back to the ghost and there were a couple other people there that ran out as well. The guy then was like "Oh, I will be back later NOOBS" and
" I WIN, I WIN, I WIN!!!" He waited until the timer was like 10 seconds to give the crystal. (we really need a kick feature for that reason)

It wasn't all bad though. The second we were done I added that person to the ignore list. One good thing did come out of that though because I was talking to the secondary monk that was doing all the rezzing and we were making fun of the guy. I told him he did good considering there were no promary monks in the group and then he offered to help me with the rest of the missions. (very, very good stuff

)

To top the whole thing off the person that we all added to the ignore list was in a guild (I could not believe it) and he started spamming join requests to me like I was gonna be dumb enough to try and make another PUG with him in it.

There should definitely be something negative towards people that are a-holes in the game. Some kind of negative fame or something.

Phantom Force · May 31, 2005, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Both issues have been addressed in threads. Both are very good ideas, hopefully a result will come from everyone's posts about these.

From a post I read today, I doubt they are necessarily xp leechers (although they could be) but another option is a PvP (not trying to put all PvP players in category) players who want to get through stuff with little work so they can advance characters to unlock skills.

****Please note don't even think of trying to flame me. I'm not pointing fingers at just PvP. There is a good possability it's coming from both PvE leechers and PvP.****

IxChel · May 31, 2005, 07:57 PM // 19:57

I think the "leader" of the group should have the kick option; no concensus needed -- if you don't trust the leader, don't join the group. Also, the map needs different colour pens -- one for each person. I also think that in groups, if someone disconnects or gets kicked, they should be replaced with a henchmen of the equivalent class.

LathalDraugr · May 31, 2005, 08:58 PM // 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by IxChel

I think the "leader" of the group should have the kick option; no concensus needed -- if you don't trust the leader, don't join the group.

A kick option for the leader would kill PvE pretty fast. You'd end up with hundreds of 1-2 man teams in towns as nearly nobody would be willing to hand that kind of control over to another player. A vote option has enough potential for abuse if you introduce a dictatoral control it would kill the game.

If you are burdened with a problematic player, quit the mission and add them to your ignore list and make sure never to group with them again. Any kind of feedback system for reporting or punishing players will be abused by the unscrupulous to cause grief for everyone else. At the moment the best they can do is waste the 5 minutes of your time it takes to work out what they are, give them the ability to kick you out of a mission that you are a few seconds away from the end of and they will use it.

trackxyj · May 31, 2005, 09:08 PM // 21:08

1) Build your own team.
2) Don't build a team around one ppl (except monk when you are lucky to get one).
3) Kick the naughty nude warrior from your team, find another before you go to mission.

Wesley Wyndam-Pryce · May 31, 2005, 10:33 PM // 22:33

You will never get this option

The people who do this "grievers" as some call them, outnumber the rest of the normal players by a good 3:1 ratio or better

For every party of 3-4 good players you have double that, that are out for just skill capturing, or item grinding

It's the same as the ignore feature, not being an ignore feature...It's a known problem that's been here since retail began and one that probably won't be fixed.

Jackell · May 31, 2005, 10:37 PM // 22:37

I'm an asshole, but in other mmo's I used to kick people who annoyed me out of my group in very dangerous areas. Purposely lead them there so they'd get killed. Even though I would have no intent of doing that here, because most of the time you need a full group to complete the mission, but there were a lot of people who did it just for shits and giggles, and plenty of them I'm sure are here too. A kick option would be abused way too much, and lead to a whole new wave of anger. It would just be replacing one downfall with another, IMO.

However, I'm a firm beleiver that if someone leaves the group, they should be replaced by a henchman of the same primary. If your monk drops, here comes Alesia to take his place.

Chief · Jun 21, 2005, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jackell

However, I'm a firm beleiver that if someone leaves the group, they should be replaced by a henchman of the same primary. If your monk drops, here comes Alesia to take his place.

Excellent Idea!!!!

Please let's get this post high on the DEVs list!

hydrak · Jun 21, 2005, 08:25 PM // 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief

1. I have been in too many missions lately that we have XP lechers or they have their own agenda altogether (basically they stay in mission and hunt for objects and will stay there until the team all quits).

2. Another is where you have people that are only after an ELITE skill and then quit team once captured.

Both of these are happening way too much and are getting out of control. I finished the game with my first character with very little difficulty and great teams. The second character I started seeing hints of #1 and #2. Now I’m on my 3rd character and it’s almost difficult to even play without things like the above happening.

RECOMMENDED FIX: Implement a vote-kick option in the game for #1.
For #2, for missions, your ELITE skill is not awarded until completion of the mission.

Your so-called "recommended fix" will only introduce more problems and abuses.
#1 fix will introduce random kick abusers.
#2 fix, if I play with a group of friends who are only interested in helping I capturing a skill, I would have a problem here if I have to finish a mission to capture it.

Canadian · Jun 21, 2005, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief

RECOMMENDED FIX: Implement a vote-kick option in the game for #1.
For #2, for missions, your ELITE skill is not awarded until completion of the mission.

Fix #1: Kickvotes will be abused, people will think it's funny... utter chaos. No kickvote, won't happen.

Sides, with a kickvote, it's only used in spite. Whether the person is off killing other things, or they are gone doesn't make a difference. If the person is agroing on purpose, that is a different story... but I haven't seen that yet.

Fix #2: This will make it even harder to get an elite skill. What if a team is out just to earn an elite skill? What if you solo a mission to get the elite skill? What if the group fails to complete the mission, and you wanted that elite skill? People quit, and you have to live with it.

Rellok · Jun 21, 2005, 08:55 PM // 20:55

I am interested in the kick vote, and I wonder if that could be implemented in a way that improves the situation. There will still be people that abuse it, either by getting 4 on a team to screw up the other 4 or whatever, but it may become much less likely.

As far as finishing a mission to get a skill? No way, people already can screw with people too much. If this were a rule someone only has to get the rest of the team to the place where they get their skills and then leave right after aggroing a bunch of monsters. I just don't think it helps at all.

I wonder if when your group leaves to do a mission if a window could pop up for each person where they have to check off mandatory objectives, and they all have to match. So that you have all 8 confirming that they want to finish the mission, or do the bonus or whatever. That way if someone runs off to do something else that they didn't agree to, and the rest of the team isn't aware of it, they could be kicked before they get what they want, and really cause a problem. I'm not sure there is a good solution, or that there needs to be one at this point. I will have to keep considering the possibilities.

Matt

Acan Vishnu · Jun 21, 2005, 09:08 PM // 21:08

Saying that something should not be implemented because it could, in some way shape or form, be abused is something you really need to look carefully at. Right now there is a problem with the system -- One person can get in a team and totally screw up 7 other's experience.

Putting in that the leader can kick doesn't really help, the power is still in one person's hands, it is still that one person can totally screw over 7, not what I would call a solution.. But in the case of a majority vote system, it would take at least four people (if a 50% majority was required, or at least 6 if a 75% majority is required) I'd call that a vast improvement.. Sure, a group of people could get together and screw around with others, but what else is new? You can do that now pretty easily.

Its a restriction on griefing. Is it a perfect solution? Not really, I don't believe they exist. There is always going to be someone not happy with some fix or another, but it could help to improve the situation.

Hysteria · Jun 21, 2005, 09:21 PM // 21:21

I also believe a kick feature might become necessary in the near future. I can't think of a simple "fair" solution but I do have a few ideas that are a bit more complicated but might require a substantial amount of coding to implement. I have seen a few XP leechers latley that just sit there at the start and do nothing to help the team through out. That's almost as bad as exploiting IMO.

IxChel · Jun 21, 2005, 09:58 PM // 21:58

There are alternatives to a kick option that are not open to abuse.